[MITgcm-support] Effect of 'vectorInvariantMomentum' flag on first order circulation
Munday, Dave
danday at bas.ac.uk
Wed Mar 8 03:48:48 EST 2017
I've been using useJamartWetPoints too, which I found helps with the noisy vertical velocity. Although I never saw the extreme problems with Coriolis seen in Jamart & Ozer.
I’ve also been using useJamartMomAdv. Although looking at the code it looks like this one doesn’t do anything with highOrderViscosity.
D
> On 8 Mar 2017, at 19:01, Andrea Cimatoribus <andrea.cimatoribus at epfl.ch> wrote:
>
> I have also been using:
> vectorInvariantMomentum=.TRUE.,
> highOrderVorticity=.TRUE.,
> to reduce noise similarly to DM, and never noticed any issue, with model comparing generally very well to observations (however, my setup is completely different from the ACC case). I was wondering if the option:
> usejamartwetpoints=.TRUE.,
> may change (fix?) the results you are having. I remember there was a reason why I set this to true but, embarrassingly, I cannot recall it now.
> Best,
> Andrea
>
> Andrea Cimatoribus
> postdoctoral researcher
> EPFL ENAC IIE ECOL
> https://people.epfl.ch/andrea.cimatoribus
>
> On 07/03/17 22:54, Jean-Michel Campin wrote:
>> i Dhruv,
>>
>> An update on your set-up behavior:
>> 1) I think I was able to reproduce the problem, running the 2 cases
>> (vectorInvariantMomentum =T vs =F) for 1 yr each, labeled 'v01' and 'f01' respectively.
>> 2) I also run the vectorInvariantMomentum=T case (label='v02') for just 6 months,
>> starting from pickup from the other run (vectorInvariantMomentum=F) at t=6.month.
>> This was useful because the flow is already eddying (@ t= 6.month)
>> but the model also switch to this "strange" behavior after less than 1 month.
>> 3) The only test I did afterward (v03) was like previous test (2) but commenting out:
>> highOrderVorticity=.TRUE.,
>> I've attached a plot of KE evolution from the monitor output.
>>
>> I have the impression that the reason of this strange behavior is a bad boundary
>> conditions (i.e., wrong land/ocean masking or some missing partial cell factor in
>> pkg/mom_vecinv/mom_vi_v_coriolis_c4.F) in the 4th Order discretization
>> of (in this case, relative) vorticity that positively feeds back
>> on the flow field to generate very strong meridional currents (northward east
>> of the ridge and southward west of the ridge), much larger (> 4.m/s) than anywhere
>> else in the domain, at least early on. This can clearly be seen on V.component plot
>> at t=7.month in my experiment "v02", starting to develop along the northern part
>> of the ridge just above the bottom cell rows (2nd wet cell above the bottom).
>>
>> Will need to figure out how this positive feedback works (I personally rarely
>> use this option highOrderVorticity=T) ; also, little bit surprised that the
>> model did not blow up, but few factors -- bottom drag + KPP + horizontal
>> viscC4leith with large viscA4GridMax -- might help to stabilize ?
>>
>> One last thing: highOrderVorticity is specific to pkg/mom_vecinv;
>> there is no equivalent in pkg/mom_fluxform (only centered 2nd Order
>> advection scheme there) and setting highOrderVorticity=T has no effect
>> when vectorInvariantMomentum=F.
>> I would expect smaller differences, in the interior, between the 2 mom pkgs
>> when highOrderVorticity is not used (especially given the masking problem !)
>> and
>> 1) vectorInvariantMomentum=T
>> with useAbsVorticity=T
>> and selectVortScheme=2
>> is compared to:
>> 2) vectorInvariantMomentum=F
>> with useEnergyConservingCoriolis=T
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Jean-Michel
>>
>> On Fri, Mar 03, 2017 at 12:34:35AM -0500, Dhruv Balwada wrote:
>>> Hi Bruno,
>>>
>>> Removing the topography made the solutions for the two cases be the same.
>>> This is crazy interesting, I think I need to understand your paper better.
>>>
>>> Best,
>>> Dhruv
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Mar 2, 2017 at 2:09 PM, Dhruv Balwada <db194 at nyu.edu> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi Bruno,
>>>>
>>>> I haven't removed the topography. I will set that up now. I did try to do
>>>> the run with no-slip and free-slip walls. The solution was the same in
>>>> both.
>>>>
>>>> Best,
>>>> Dhruv
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Mar 2, 2017 at 2:08 PM, Dhruv Balwada <db194 at nyu.edu> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi Jean-Michel,
>>>>>
>>>>> The experiment setup is now available at - https://github.com/dhruvbalw
>>>>> ada/channel_run_20km
>>>>>
>>>>> I am using a version of the MITgcm that I downloaded in the beginning of
>>>>> February.
>>>>>
>>>>> The difference between two runs appears in a matter of 1 year of the run.
>>>>> I would probably run it for 2-3 years to see it clearly. On the computers
>>>>> here with 25 cores it took about 1 hour to run. So, its very fast.
>>>>>
>>>>> Let me know if you need any other files, and I can add them to the git
>>>>> directory.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>> Dhruv
>>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Mar 2, 2017 at 10:37 AM, Jean-Michel Campin <jmc at mit.edu> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Dhruv,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> OK, this is a good start.
>>>>>> Could you provide me (off the list since there is some strict size limit
>>>>>> there)
>>>>>> a complete copy of the set up, including the customized/modified "code"
>>>>>> directory,
>>>>>> the input parameter files ( data*, eedata) and the binary input files
>>>>>> needed
>>>>>> to run the set-up.
>>>>>> Also, if you are not using the latest MITgcm code, which version is it ?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And finally, how long would I need to run it to see some significant
>>>>>> differences
>>>>>> (this was part of my earlier email, but not clearly expressed).
>>>>>> May be a pickup file could allow to reduce the length of these tests ?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>> Jean-Michel
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 01, 2017 at 05:47:25PM -0500, Dhruv Balwada wrote:
>>>>>>> Hi Jean-Michel,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I tried the test you suggested by turning off all optimization, and
>>>>>> nothing
>>>>>>> changed. Here are the outputs in prints of python notebooks. I have
>>>>>> also
>>>>>>> attached the opt and data file. The data file for both runs point to
>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> exact same forcing files on the hard drive.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Best,
>>>>>>> Dhruv
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Tue, Feb 28, 2017 at 10:27 AM, Dhruv Balwada <db194 at nyu.edu> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hello everyone,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thanks for the quick responses.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> @ Jean-Michel I will follow your suggestions and report back on them
>>>>>> soon.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Best,
>>>>>>>> Dhruv
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Mon, Feb 27, 2017 at 3:56 PM, Jean-Michel Campin <jmc at mit.edu>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Hi Dhruv,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> It's a strange results. Both pkgs (mom_fluxform and mom_vecinv)
>>>>>> have been
>>>>>>>>> tested and used in many different configs, and no significant recent
>>>>>>>>> changes
>>>>>>>>> that would be suspicious.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I suggest to try to work on a short test run:
>>>>>>>>> 1) long enough to detect some significant differences between the 2
>>>>>> cases:
>>>>>>>>> vectorInvariantMomentum=T and = F
>>>>>>>>> 2) short enough so that the same 2 runs could be repeated with zero
>>>>>>>>> compiler
>>>>>>>>> optimization (-ieee or -devel with many standard optfile).
>>>>>>>>> And from there, we could work on trying to reproduce the problem on
>>>>>>>>> different machine/compiler ... etc.
>>>>>>>>> Once we are able to reproduce the problem, should not take too long
>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>> fix.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>>> Jean-Michel
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Feb 23, 2017 at 02:58:53PM -0500, Dhruv Balwada wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Hi MITgcm community,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I have recently been stumped an issue with the MITgcm
>>>>>>>>> vectorInvariantMomentum
>>>>>>>>>> flag.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> **The model setup** is meant to be an ideal representation of the
>>>>>> ACC
>>>>>>>>>> (following Abernathey and Cessi 2014). It has the following
>>>>>> components -
>>>>>>>>>> a) Linear temperature relaxation at the surface
>>>>>>>>>> b) Zonal wind with sinusoidal structure
>>>>>>>>>> c) Initial temp field is zonally symmetric and the thermocline
>>>>>> shoals
>>>>>>>>> from
>>>>>>>>>> north to south (similar to the ACC).
>>>>>>>>>> d) Resolution is 20km, and domain size is 2000km * 2000km.
>>>>>>>>>> e) Zonally periodic and meridional walls
>>>>>>>>>> f) A zonal gaussian bump is the topographic feature, which is
>>>>>>>>> meridionaly
>>>>>>>>>> independent.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> **The issue** I am facing is that the circulation pattern
>>>>>> completely
>>>>>>>>>> changes when I change the "vectorInvariantMomentum" flag.
>>>>>>>>>> When the flag is set to false (default), the model recreates an
>>>>>> ACC like
>>>>>>>>>> flow. Flow is from west to east and strongly perturbed by the
>>>>>> presence
>>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>>> topography.
>>>>>>>>>> When the flag is set to true (default), the model does something
>>>>>> else.
>>>>>>>>> Flow
>>>>>>>>>> is from east to west, with a strong boundary flow from the west
>>>>>> to east
>>>>>>>>>> near the southern boundary.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Any help would be appreciated.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I have posted some visualizations and data file here -
>>>>>>>>>> https://sites.google.com/site/dhruvbalwada/blog/mitgcmissuew
>>>>>>>>> ithvectorinvariantmomentumflag
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Here is the data file (obviously the vectorinvariantmomentum flag
>>>>>> is
>>>>>>>>>> changed between two runs.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> &PARM01
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> # viscosity
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> viscAr=5.6614E-04,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> viscC4Leith=2.15,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> viscC4Leithd=2.15,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> viscA4GridMax=0.8,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> useAreaViscLength=.TRUE.,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> highOrderVorticity=.TRUE.,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> # diffusivity
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> tempAdvScheme=7,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> diffKrT=5.44e-7,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> saltStepping=.FALSE.,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> staggerTimeStep=.TRUE.,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> # multiDimAdvection=.TRUE.,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> vectorInvariantMomentum=.TRUE.,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> # initial vertical profiles of T and S
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> sRef=30*35.0000,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> # equation of state
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> eosType='LINEAR',
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> tAlpha=2.0E-04,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> sBeta=0.0,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> # boundary conditions
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> no_slip_sides=.FALSE.,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> no_slip_bottom=.TRUE.,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> # bottomDragLinear=1.1E-03,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> bottomDragQuadratic=0.0021,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> # physical parameters
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> f0=-0.9E-04,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> beta=1.0E-11,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> gravity=9.81,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> # implicit diffusion and convective adjustment
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> implicitDiffusion=.TRUE.,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> implicitViscosity=.TRUE.,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> # exact volume conservation
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> exactConserv=.TRUE.,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> # C-V scheme for Coriolis term
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> useCDscheme=.FALSE.,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> # partial cells for smooth topography
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> hFacMin=5.0E-02,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> # file IO stuff
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> readBinaryPrec=64,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> useSingleCpuIO=.TRUE.,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> debugLevel=1,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> &
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>>>>> MITgcm-support at mitgcm.org
>>>>>>>>>> http://mitgcm.org/mailman/listinfo/mitgcm-support
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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